Whites Preferred (White Guys Have Their Say)
Continued from previous page.... 05:00AM Just because "the rest of the world" holds up non-Caucasian men as the epitome of beauty doesn't mean I have to chastise my dick for not getting hard when I see them! CHRIST some of you people really is insane! 05:10AM Now I've heard everything. If I'm not attracted to you, I must be a racist. Check what you are saying, and see who the racists really are. If a white person isn't attracted to me he must be racist - what is that if not a racist generalization. Not being sexually attracted to someone does not mean one is a bigot against him. Where did THAT come from? Especially since the way the original post was worded was that he "isn't attracted" to a non-Caucasian. Not that he categorically ruled it out in the future. Where is all this knee-jerk racist stuff coming from? 05:17AM Bravo 5:00AM! You just described the gay experience! How many Caucasian men are dismayed at some time in their lives that str8 men do not return the attraction. Grow up! We've all been there in some way. 05:22AM 11:34PM, how many Asians have YOU fucked, you hypocritical bigot? I don't feel any hatred. I'm as sexually indifferent to Asian men as to Asian women (or even pre-teen girls). Zero on the 'hubba-hubba' meter. Is that so fucking difficult for people to understand? What the HELL is wrong with you people? And you, 2:26AM, are just as fucking clueless. Am I supposed to be sexually attracted and hot for every single human being before you'll accept me as human?? Are YOU?!? I am no white trash. I am not racist. I am not hateful. I am not any of those things. Like 5:17AM said, GROW UP! 5:57AM Am I a misogynist because I don't find a single woman attractive?? Why won't anyone address this single question? Because I haven't (yet) found any Asians attractive, why the fuck does people assume I'm some hateful white-trash bigot?!? I have never seen such sweeping generalizations before tonight. Sounds like the crap I took for not being sexually attracted to women (who I think are beautiful). I had this conversation with some people when I first came out, back in the 80's... I came out as gay, and their first reaction was "Why do you hate women?!?" AUGH! I don't hate women! I don't hate Asians! Stop asking me when I'm going to stop beating my wife! 07:38AM What about those of us who prefer non-smokers? 07:41AM All of you anti-smokers are just plain bigots. BIGOT! BIGOT! BIGOT! Imagine judging someone for the color of their lungs! 08:18AM Nope you are not racist. It's a preference that's all. When I post an ad I generally say I like them tall & hung. This usually excludes anyone Asian etc. 08:25AM OP, I think the issue here is that you got upset when someone called your preferences "racist." You like to think you are a good person through and through. But take a step back and look at the situation. Your personal ad DOES fit a definition of "racist" (meaning, "prejudiced categorically against certain races"). You're pretty much "whites only, please." I would advise you to grow a thicker skin and admit that your preference is racist under the literal definition of the word. Just like someone whose ad says "GWM age 37 seeking 18-24" -- well, that ad IS youth-fixated. And if you said to the man "so, you're into twinks..." would he be right to get all defensively upset at your words? My own prejudices include not being attracted to men with thin lips that are lousy for kissing. Also not usually into men who are shorter than 5'9", because I'm tall. There are other things that turn me off, too. His speaking voice has got to be at least sort-of-masculine in pitch and tone. But in general my prejudices don't rule out any one racial group, categorically. It just sucks for you that yours do, and therefore your prejudices ARE racist by literal definition. Assuming that your attractions will not change, then you'd be wise to learn to deal with it if you continue using the personal ads. 08:32AM You're not a racist, you're stupid to look for dates in the personal ads though....to dangerous! 08:38AM No one should have to defend what attracts or doesn't attract them (something gay people should well understand). I am sure some people call you racist. Rejection always hurts and it is racist in the strictest sense of the word, but it's your own business. It's not like you are denying anyone a job or promoting segregation. Ads I see start with "Gay white male seeks same". That should get the message across. 08:53AM No one even mentions - the class distinction here...most of the gays who are doing these generalized searches also want an "educated" and or "professional" - how many searches have you seen for a "uneducated, redneck, or welfare recipient" - there are so many forms of limiting your choices. The gays are very class and status conscience. 08:56AM Don't know what iceberg you are on 8:53 but society in general is very class and status conscience not just the gays. 09:00AM White Male here - I would rather have a good looking, fun, intelligent, Black/Hispanic male than some lowlife white trash any day. I think it's the person who is important. 09:04AM Yeah 9:00 it is more than obvious that you do value the human being. I would even go so far as to say you sound like a real people person! Good luck to you and keep passing out those daisies and contradicting statements. You rock and I can feel the love just pouring out of you. 09:08AM I'm not 9:00, but I find your remark rather and snide and vague. Whatever you think of his comment, your remarks are just biter and uncalled for. 09:26AM I'd like to throw in my two cents, if I may. Hey, if you're white and you like white guys, then you are probably on the right track. That goes for all other ethnicities as well. I'm black, I like black guys. But, being black and gay limits who I can date. The stigma of being both makes it for me to find someone. The church and the level of machismo in general in black society makes it tough. For that reason, and others, I want to(kinda have to) keep myself open to the idea of dating men of other ethicists. For anyone who prefers another ethnicity over their own, they aren't exactly wrong for it but again, they limit themselves. That is due to so many different factors that it could make ones' head explode. 09:40AM OK, I admit it. According to this thread, I'm a racist because I have preferences as to who I find attractive. I'm sure everyone is some form of "ist" so I have plenty of company. I'd say I was in good company but then someone would accuse me of not liking bad company on here. 09:45AM Gays didn't used to be class and status conscious, but they didn't used to be racist or sexist either. There is something trashy about all this ink devoted to excluding people. There really is a better way. 09:46AM You are not a racist, OP. But it is poor taste to be so blatant about your restrictions. I've never had sex with a black man or an Asian. It's just never happened that I've clicked with a gay one. There was one hunky Chinese-American guy I had a crush on years ago, but he was straight. And most of the black gay guys I've met have either been extraordinarily elitist or trashy, either too good for me or too disgusting. Oh well. I'm "married" now and probably will never have a chance to experience a mixed race relationship. I'm over it. 09:51AM Gays didn't used to be class and status conscious, but they didn't used to be racist or sexist either. We didn't? Just when was that? I've been gay for over 65 years and, as far as I know, we have always been subject to the same faults as everyone else, racism, sexism, class consciousness. 09:52AM 9:45 has been watching too many sanitized gay movies. We are not all saints and martyrs. 09:54AM Since when has personal preference been a fault? Excluding someone from a job, from your club, from your circle of friends, ok. But excluding someone from your bed? If I like a certain look and not another, then yes, I'm exclusionary but I'm not a racist. 09:55AM Absolutely, 9:54. "Discriminating", in the truest sense, is not a bad word. 09:56AM So what about ugly gay men? If I don't like ugly gay men and don't want to go to bed with them, what does that make me? Racist? This is where the logic some are using falls apart. It's a physical attraction we're talking about here, not a job or a club invitation. 09:59AM Actually, this thread has been fascinating to me to watch. Being politically correct today has made some people afraid to express a personal preference for whose dick they want in their mouth. Others just think if you exclude their dick from your mouth, you're automatically a racist. Still others have expressed their feelings and indicated their preferences. Fascinating to watch and yet what do we learn from all of this? 10:14AM It's interesting to me, too, 9:59. We have here a white man who puts a personal ad saying in effect "I am only attracted to other white men" and then becomes upset when someone calls his ad (and, by extension, him) racist. He is thinking of the more extreme definition of racism. There is a broader definition. Webster's includes both, as shown below: Main Entry: rac•ism Pronunciation: 'rA-"si-z&m also -"shi- Function: noun Date: 1936 1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race 2 : racial prejudice or discrimination - rac•ist /-sist also -shist/ noun or adjective. Is our OP a racist per Definition 1? No, absolutely not. Is he a racist per Definition 2? Maybe, sort of, depends on how you view the definition. That's where it gets more ambiguous. 10:19AM He doesn't actually specify race in the ad, it only comes out when he actually speaks to these people on the phone. If I was to encounter that it would really put me on the spot. Why not just casually state in the ad "White seeks same". Non-whites will get the message and won't call. 10:19AM 4:21 wrote "WHY DON'T BLACKS LIKE BLACKS". Simple answer. Some blacks are as racist against other blacks as are some whites. It's hard to live in this country and not have some of that racism rub off on you. 10:32AM Other guys have rejected me because I'm too young, too old, too white, not white enough, too much hair on my chest, not enough hair on my chest, too preppy, not preppy enough. I've rejected people for all sorts of reasons too. Bottom line I see from this in my interpretation is that the people who are defensive about this and calling people like the OP racist have probably been rejected at some time and didn't like it. Nobody likes being rejected but I don't care if it's because the guy isn't sexually attracted to me. That's life. Now if that same man/woman wouldn't offer me a job because of how I look in spite of being the best candidate for the job, I'd scream racism too. To me, racism is about being rejected for who you are in everything other than sexual attraction. 10:39AM Another issue about the link at 02:38AM is an unbalanced preference for whites by blacks that is presented as a civil rights access issue. I mean step back and look at it. It is like: well we got white houses and white jobs, now we want white sex. WTF is that about? Underneath it is an implicit repressed inferiority, as if white sex is better and blacks are being denied something better that whites have, namely, whites! Differences between groups simply exist. RACISM is consciously placing values on those differences. If there is any racism involved here it is blacks who are 'placing values' that prefer dating outside their own race or even 'demand' it as some kind of right. I'm white and I've come to recognize what generally attracts me in terms of a number of variables, and it 'discriminates' against 1/2 to 2/3 of other white guys! Whatever 'causes' this is NOT a conscious choice. What actually creates 'that special spark' still eludes me, and I have NO MORE CONTROL over whatever that is than whatever defines my attraction to men vs. women, and I'm a Kinsey 7. If you view dating as some social-climbing function whereby you hope to 'improve' yourself like some female, you are not only a slut you are deluded and have no such 'rights'. Otherwise, sexual attraction has nothing to do with politics. To repeat: I have NO MORE CONTROL over whatever sexually attracts me in an individual man than whatever defines my attraction to men in general. 10:56AM " There is something trashy about all this ink devoted to excluding people. " Ahh, ... it's the 21st Century and that isn't ink, it's just electrons dancing on the inside of your monitor screen. No trees have been murdered. And, as no electrons were created or destroyed in the process, all's well with the Cosmos. 11:28AM To my knowledge, I have never been rejected because of my race. I doubt people would say to me that they were rejecting me because of my race, however, just as I would never say to someone that I was rejecting them because of their race. It's just rude. I have rejected many guys over the years, and there are many ways of doing it so as to not hurt their feelings. The main reason I reject someone is because they aren't attractive to me. Would I say that, however? Would I say, "sorry, you are homely," or, "sorry you have more than 20% body fat"? No. Another big reason I reject people is because of their sexual mores (I don't like to date sluts, sorry). Would I say, "Sorry, I don't have any interests in tramps"? No. These are simply rude ways of handling those situations. I say something like, "thanks, I'm flattered, but I'm not interested," and leave it at that. The OP PRECLUDED romantic consideration of the caller: he prejudged the caller's suitability categorically, person unseen. That's what makes the situation he describes somewhat ambiguous. What makes it offensive is that he declared the caller's race unacceptable. You just don't say that, just like you don't say someone is too fat, ugly, or not bright enough. (In fact, rejecting someone because of their racial status, person unseen, makes that racial status seem to be on par with fat, ugly, or not too bright.) It's called being polite, not politically correct. Whatever happened to class and civility? OP's "honesty" is not a virtue. It's tacky and vulgar. I have never precluded consideration of anyone because of their race. Why? Because people can be sexually attractive regardless of race. There are gorgeous men all over the world, and people who don't know this really have to travel more or open their eyes wider. I have a hard time understanding how someone can say that people of other races or ethnicities are not sexually attractive. How unimaginative and limiting, but hey, it's your life, sad though it may be. 11:37AM Pretty well said 11:28. I've found myself attracted to men of different ethnic groups at various times in my life. Usually when they're much different from me in appearance of course, they tend to be what I consider stunning. 11:51AM Then there are those who would jump anything in pants slightly above room temperature. 11:55AM Exactly...what used to get me was when I'd be in an online chat, and I'd be really "hitting it off" with someone. Not matter how interested the person seemed, once he found out you were black, the chat ended there. Picture unseen. Yeah, it's rude, but hey, it's an online chat so what can you expect? It's a nasty business regardless of one's race. When you're a minority in this "community," you have to learn that the cultural narrative of "being gay" is different for you. No wonder minorities self-segregate away. It's not like when you're overweight and one can go on a diet and work out and be accepted. Hey, you could be fuckin' Shemar Moore or Taye Diggs and be ripped as all get-out and still not be included. The gay community is a microcosm of the mainstream world, and last time I checked, it's still pretty segregated. 11:57AM White man here but I'd take Shemar Moore any day while sending Wesley Snipes back to the other side of the room 12:01PM "Periodically, I run a companion ad..." What a pompous git. For all the talk of "I'm not attracted to blahblahblah" you get some schlub who clearly can't hook up in a non-ad situation going on about what he is or isn't attracted to. Like any dudes are running after him in the first place! Darling, very few people are attracted to you, so knock off the pathetic attempt to stroke your own ego by rejecting others. The worst sort of gays do this: having gone through life being rejected, they somehow think that if they blab about not being attracted to blacks or Hispanics or Asians, it somehow means they're not rejects themselves. Of course they could achieve their same goal by just shutting up and moving on (hey, I'm not attracted to blonds, but I don't feel the need to make that part of profile). Instead, they have to act like some overburdened prom queen with too many unsuitable guys chasing her prize ass--as if!! GET OVER YOURSELVES. There are NO black or Hispanic or Asian guys lusting over the likes of you in the first place! 12:04PM "White man here but I'd take Shemar Moore any day while sending Wesley Snipes back to the other side of the room." Keep dreaming. Neither of them are interested in you. 12:09PM Nobody said they were interested in me 12:04. I just used it as an illustration which you obviously didn't get. Attraction comes in many different colors and rejection comes in just as many. 01:10PM Trust me, I got your rather facile illustration. Just not buying into your fantasies (that you would be in a position to "take" Shemar, and that you would be in a position to reject Wesley). 01:11PM " The gay community is a microcosm of the mainstream world. " And "segregation" is a two way street. Forced integration schemes come unraveled as much from blacks preferring to be with there "own kind" as whites. Worst, how many of you insist on not seeing that protocols having to do with employment and housing, have nothing to do with sex partners. You can't be that obtuse (I hope). 01:15PM 1:11, discrimination by private parties in private matters that are inconsequential to employment or housing or public accommodations are not covered by civil rights legislation. And yet, no one ever said that it was covered by such "protocols." Come back when you have something to contribute to the discussion. 01:16PM this is fascinating.... 01:17PM OP and others have you ever even allowed yourself to get to know a man of a different race? Before you reject him out right, sit down talk... maybe you have more in common with him that you would think, just because a guy is of the same race does not mean you will have a lick in common with him. If you are talking about dating and not just fucking! They're maybe many ways to reject someone, but no matter how you say it someone's feelings will be hurt. And trust me it hurts. 01:18PM The point is that much of gay congregation is geared toward finding sex partners. When gay men only desire those of the same race, you get white gay clubs, black gay clubs, etc. However, if that AOL study is accurate, it isn't exactly a "two-way street." 01:21PM Again, the AOL study is not a survey, it is not representative of the gay community. It is a study of personal ads. Are people who place such ads representative of the gay community? I don't know, but I don't know anyone who places these things. My sense of it is that these are not the most social people in the community. 02:05PM 11:28, that's it, exactly! 02:24PM For the OP to be so put out, I would imagine that he would have to be overrun with LOTS AND LOTS of non-white gay men responding. Now, the truth is, very few non-whites responded to his ad. In fact, there aren't a whole hell of a lot of people responding to him in life, period, which is why he needs the ad. For all the "aggravation" he went through if a couple of black guys harmlessly answered the ad, he could have simply been polite and told them that he had found someone already. It would have been the polite thing to do. No one needs to be told that they can't be considered because they are not white, just like you wouldn't like to be told you are not considered because of something you have no control over. That some of you bigots don't see the racism in paralleling race with height, weight, drug-usage shows what simpletons you are. The OP did not need to get on a soapbox to dramatically tell the world that..."drumroll"...he is ONLY into white guys. Gay men of other races the world around are now crushed. Well, not quite. You see, certain insecure gay men--having been rejected most of their lives--make it a point to let the world know how, among gay men, only certain types will fit their bill. As 11:28 put it: "You just don't say that, just like you don't say someone is too fat, ugly, or not bright enough. (In fact, rejecting someone because of their racial status, person unseen, makes that racial status seem to be on par with fat, ugly, or not too bright.) It's called being polite, not politically correct. Whatever happened to class and civility? OP's "honesty" is not a virtue. It's tacky and vulgar." His point isn't to run a specific ad. It's to make himself feel better about being a reject by getting on a soapbox and bleating to the world about what he likes and doesn't like. 02:36PM Many gay men have a real self-esteem problem. These guys like to cut down others in any way they can. And that means putting down people they perceive to have lesser status. That could mean someone who drives car that's not as fancy as theirs, or someone who lives in a less desirable part of town, or went to a school that is not as prestigious, someone who is out of shape, someone who makes less money, someone who is a member of a minority group, someone who has a disability, someone with a small or even average sized penis, someone who is uncircumcised or circumcised, or someone who is less attractive. Gay men will bash their fellow gay men who fall into any of these categories. Count on it. It's ugly, and there is nothing anyone can do to change it. Just remember it says more about the person saying it, than it does about the group it is said about. These people are the ones with a problem. 02:36PM I think you are correct. People who are truly self-confident (and who have a sense of basic decency and class) do not make these kinds of comments. "Not very sporting," as James Mason in "North by Northwest" might have put it. 03:03PM I might prefer white guys, but I have never actually seen one. The palest guys I've seen have some pigment in the skin. They may be pink or tan or a little of both. Their hair is never white, except for Jonathan Winter's. Even he has pink skin and blue eyes. Will I ever find someone who is truly white . . or will I have to start rolling my men in bleached flour? 03:07PM Darlings. Some people will always ask for a chicken Caesar salad no matter where they are dining. They will never know the wonder of waking up next to the warm form of a beautiful man whose looks, language, culture and essence may be entirely different from one's own. A world of such richness! Yet... Chicken Caesar salad, please. Chicken Caesar salad, please. It is sad, but there is nothing we can do for them.  RELATED LINKS
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